I’m rarely all that into Cenk Ungar’s analysis, but I think he’s spot on reading the headlines and between the lines of the public statements. Unless Biden has the same kind of hold on the Democratic Party that Trump has on the GOP, he’s going to be pressured to drop out.
And the Republicans – they may be sorry they pushed for this – although watching Biden last night, he’s not going to recover. People are comparing it to Obama’s first dismal debate performance, but that was due to some very bad debate prep and advice coming from people who wouldn’t let Obama be Obama. He killed it in the second debate. Biden is only going to get worse.
Same thing with comparisons to Fetterman. First, Fetterman went into the debate ahead in the polls. Secondly, he had a stroke – a condition that youngish people can recover from. What we witnesses last night – those of us who have had relatives and elderly friends in decline – it’s not going to reverse itself. It’s only going to get worse. He managed to ace SOTU, but that was his last hurrah. He is only going to go downhill from here, and if he stays in the race it will only speed it up. And if he somehow manages to pull out a win, I think the second term will kill him early.
He has performed pretty well as President because he put together an excellent team. Most of that team will probably still be around with a replacement candidate.
He did well on substance, but nobody pays attention to substance. He has cognition, but voters want a President who is forceful, or at minimum they want to be able to hear you’re voice when you’re talking into a microphone. It’s a huge contrast to his “Will you shut up clown” performance, and if anything the format benefitted Trump by preventing him from being a jackass. I’m even wondering if Biden would have benefitted from an audience.
But Cenk is right. The wheels are spinning and there will be enormous pressure on him to suspend his campaign. What happens next? That’s going to be exciting to watch.
95 comments
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June 28, 2024 at 1:15 pm
Mitch
Rather than have the Democrats replace Biden, perhaps the Jews can replace the current electorate. With a new electorate, it would be possible to make America great.
June 28, 2024 at 1:37 pm
Just Trollin
I actually think that if dems draft newsom, he’d decline. He’d have a tough time defending his fiscal management of California, and he’s young enough to bide his time and wait for a better time…..
June 28, 2024 at 1:47 pm
Just Trollin
Recent 538 polls, pre debate, have Trump ahead in Jersey and Minnesota. Wow…..
June 28, 2024 at 2:31 pm
Anonymous
Biden is only going to get worse.
Speculation. 130 days is a long enough time to change the current hand-wringing worry that he’s not the right candidate.
June 28, 2024 at 3:21 pm
Just Trollin
Guess he forgot about the Afghanistan withdrawal, or did he just tell a lie ?
June 28, 2024 at 3:40 pm
Just Trollin
In 10 seconds, his handicap went from 6 to 8. Or was he lying ?
June 28, 2024 at 4:00 pm
Anonymous
Just watched the “90% likelihood of Biden being replaced on the ticket” commentary on Young Turks, and I would say the likelihood is less than that, but not much less. More like between 60-70%.
June 28, 2024 at 4:25 pm
Anonymous
Since Mitch clearly finds sarcasm and irony to be funny (so do I, by the way), perhaps American Jews like the ones who run CNN corporate – not to mention the two insufferably incompetent Jewish “moderators” last night (bleached-blonde Dana Bash & wimpy-as-heck Jake Tapper) – can step aside for some Palestinian-American replacements. According to Donald Trump, at least we don’t have to worry about the Palestinians being “weak”.
June 28, 2024 at 5:10 pm
Anonymous
Are you doing OK Mitch?
June 28, 2024 at 5:11 pm
Anonymous
my guess is 90% chance he doesn’t drop out, unless the polls plummet.
June 28, 2024 at 6:34 pm
Henchman Of Justice
I can only write,
June 28, 2024 at 7:17 pm
Anonymous
voters want a President who is forceful, or at minimum they want to be able to hear you’re voice when you’re talking into a microphone.
So voters want a President who will never be hoarse from a cold or have laryngitis, even for a day. Well that’s an interesting new criteria!
Also, as we all know, once you lose your voice, you only get worse. No one has ever recovered from a raspy voice!
June 28, 2024 at 7:22 pm
Anonymous
“my guess is 90% chance he doesn’t drop out, unless the polls plummet.“
That sounds about right to me. And I’ll add, probably a 90% chance that he does drop out if his standing in the polls does crash…and probably more than a 95% chance if it’s like a 10 point drop or more.
June 28, 2024 at 7:48 pm
Anonymous
Well one post-debate poll is in, and…
#New general Election Poll – Post debate
Biden 45% (+1)
Trump 44%
(Last poll was a tie)
Morning Consult – 2000 RV – 6/28
Will take a lot more polls like this to change the narrative, but if others come in like this I would expect the “he has to drop out” talk to dissipate pretty quickly.
Conversely if most show a big drop I would expect such calls to escalate pretty quickly.
The tricky question, of course is what happens if the polls are all over the place.
https://x.com/PpollingNumbers/status/1806835998036250886
June 28, 2024 at 7:54 pm
Anonymous
One thing’s for sure — we’re headed for at least a week or so of this:
https://x.com/Blake_Allen13/status/1806838988042391728
June 28, 2024 at 8:10 pm
Anonymous
Also from a post-debate poll: 60% say they think Biden should drop out.
The plot twist: It’s the same Morning Consut poll in which Biden is beating Trump 46-45!
At first glance it seems like a crazy contradiction. But when you think about it, it isn’t necessarily contradictory at all, nor should it be surprising. It just means there is a sizeable number of voters who would rather have a choice other than Biden vs Trump, but who nonetheless plan to vote for Biden over Trump if that’s the choice. And that’s nothing new.
June 28, 2024 at 8:21 pm
Anonymous
Ipsos polled the same people before and after the debate. Most thought Trump performed better, and there was a decline, mostly among Democrats, of how the respondents rated Biden’s mental and physical fitness.
But there was very little change (if any) in voting intentions:
June 29, 2024 at 4:08 am
Just Trollin
I got a polling call last night. I gave biden a full throated endorsement. Stay the course Joey!
June 29, 2024 at 6:29 am
Anonymous
Data for Progress post-debate poll shows a 3 point lead for Trump. In head-to-head matches between Trump and 8 different Biden alternatives, results all virtually identical — Trump with 2-3 point lead. Numbers for Biden and Harris identical.
Not sure the numbers for the “alternatives” are all that meaningful, as they haven’t had a chance to prove themselves as candidates one way or the other, and in (with the exception of Harris) haven’t been attacked much by GOP. But for what it’s worth, at this point there’s no runaway favorite among them — no one with any clear advantage over either Biden, or Trump.
https://x.com/DataProgress/status/1807048989298057656
June 29, 2024 at 6:31 am
Mitch
Anonymous, I ‘m doing fine, except for minor worries about America, Israel, and the people living in the soon to be unsurvivable-at-times parts of the planet. There are some great shows on Netflix.
June 29, 2024 at 6:36 am
Mitch
im still waiting for the movie version of Ministry for the Future. Done well, it would have tens of times the political impact of anything any politician or party says. The first chapter would suffice.
June 29, 2024 at 7:13 am
Anonymous
More important than polling is going to be the donations. It’s way too soon to assess the polling. The big donors want him out.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2024/06/28/influential-donors-biden-drop-out/74243603007/
We’ll see by next week if there’s a major drop in small donors.
I think it’s done. Either Biden drops out or Trump is President.
June 29, 2024 at 7:14 am
Just Trollin
PAC….the “alternatives” vote is TDS on display…..
June 29, 2024 at 7:16 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
Those two anon posts were mine, the one checking in on you Mitch and the 90% chance Biden will be the nominee. It’s 100% Biden or Harris, I’d prefer it to be Harris. The more the Harris supporters get on the same page and ask Biden to gracefully step down, the greater the chance it will happen.
June 29, 2024 at 7:16 am
Eric Kirk
More important than polling is going to be the donations. It’s way too soon to assess the polling. The big donors want him out.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2024/06/28/influential-donors-biden-drop-out/74243603007/
We’ll see by next week if there’s a major drop in small donors.
I think it’s done. Either Biden drops out or Trump is President. The Democrats have to show that they’re better than the Republican Party and are willing to be responsive to voters. Any other candidate will defeat Trump. Even Harris.
June 29, 2024 at 7:23 am
Mitch
Eric,
I tend to think of the “undecided” vote as people who are ashamed to tell pollsters they’ll vote for trump and might conceivably be convinced to switch with the right argument or candidate. And I think everyone else is going to vote for or against trump, unless the alternative repels them.
I’m curious about your thoughts about that as a summary, and which candidates you think might draw them away.
June 29, 2024 at 7:26 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
This* is what bothers me tho, and always has. Our self-delusion. I’m convinced we all knew JT’s videos had more than a grain of truth to them but we were silent about. Well now we’ve had an hour and a half live feed of Biden and how much? 50 minutes? 10? Could be similarly clipped and the entire nation saw it or had the chance to see it.
What now, do we force people to suppress their own feelings, there own perceptions of unease and uncertainty by calling them cowards or traitors as in Vichy media in the name of being a good team player or is it possible for us to be honest with both ourselves and the nation? T minus 128 days.
*The most viral line of the debate. Yet in their insane rush to toss the president – and his sitting vice president – the feckless whitebread Vichy media has completely missed it. Not enough #BlackJobs on news desks.
https://x.com/tomwatson/status/1807021436474736862
June 29, 2024 at 7:33 am
Anonymous
The Democrats have to show they’re willing to be responsive to voters…by ignoring the polls in favor of donor preferences? Hmmm.
I do agree it’s too soon to really assess the polls. More will need to accumulate before any firm conclusions can be drawn.
I disagree that donor sentiment will be more determinative than polling results. Once the polling becomes clear, onors will mostly follow the polls.
The OMG-Biden-Is-Toast-And-Must-Step-Down hot takes among the Extremely Online could turn out to be correct. They also may not. We’ll have to see how the polls shape up over the next few weeks.
June 29, 2024 at 7:34 am
Eric Kirk
Mitch – I don’t think the debate will actually convert many votes towards Trump per se. What it did and will do is to demoralize the Democratic base and suppress its constituency turnout.
Honestly, I don’t even know if it’s fair to Biden to push this. Have you ever seen the before/after photos of Presidents – how much they age in four years? It’s actually kind of terrifying. It’s a very high pressure job and Biden’s presidency has been hit with clusterfuck bad luck. If he manages to pull a miracle because Trump completely implodes before here and November – which is entirely possible, but not something I would want to bet the survival of democracy on – Biden will not survive his second term.
We were in denial of his condition because of the cheap fake videos, but then we witnessed it in live time. It doesn’t matter if he had “a cold” and he’s fine now – the debate was his moment to show he could handle this. It wasn’t even a poor performance. It was a disaster politically. And medically – he’s not going to get any better.
June 29, 2024 at 7:36 am
Mitch
I do know that MSNBC is not objective, but I find it very believable that a decent percentage of voters are more worried about the possibility of a lying racist sexist narcissist felon retaking the oval office than the fact that an old man had a bad night.
June 29, 2024 at 7:39 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
The Democrats have to show that they’re better than the Republican Party and are willing to be responsive to voters
You mean polls and perhaps media, not voters. The votes in the primary have already been tallied.
Here is more from Watson whom I think represents large donors to our party admirably. And he and his…please pardon me, ilk, control the inner workings of our party in our neoliberal era.
Only @NydiaVelazquez got it right. The rest of you are pure Vichy. Yes, you.
https://x.com/tomwatson/status/1806858409561448659
June 29, 2024 at 7:41 am
Mitch
Eric,
Thanks for the response. I suppose I’m unusually rich in TDS, but I’d vote for a pile of dogshit running against trump, and I think the more one learns about trump, the more likely one is to enthusiastically support the alternative.
I think outrage can be a good motivator, and people should be outraged that a felon who claims Democrats are pro-infanticide ought to be usable to create a decent bit of outrage. I think the Democrats should give Jon a hearing and then run the other way.
June 29, 2024 at 7:44 am
Anonymous
The only “grain” of truth in the deceptively edited GOP troll video clips is that Biden is old, which literally no one denies.
June 29, 2024 at 7:45 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
Some NY Democratic consultant with a Twitter account named Tom Watson agrees with you Mitch as does John Fetterman. Their numbers are legion and it’s the same loud group (minus a lot of KHive (social media Harris supporters) probably) who were the resisters and the most ardent (and Sanders-hating) of the Clinton supporters. You’ve got company friend.
https://x.com/tomwatson/status/1806857812154196310
June 29, 2024 at 7:46 am
Mitch
I also think one of the best points Biden made — and I admit I may be more interested in numbers than others — was that 40 of 45 trump advisers have said they wouldn’t vote for him, and that 158 or 159 historians surveyed rated trump as the worst President in American history. I’d like the election to be about four things: (1) trump claims you support infanticide because you believe in Roe v Wade; (2) trump’s own people won’t vote for him; (3) scholars say trump was the worst President in American history; (4) trump was responsible for, at-minimum, hundreds of thousands of needless COVID deaths and actually suggested bleach, on TV.
June 29, 2024 at 7:53 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
We were in denial of his condition because of the cheap fake videos, but then we witnessed it in live time.
They weren’t fake, they were real until probably a few fake ones popped up. That’s denial of, yes, a less than trustworthy source. But there are tens of millions of Americans who do believe them, and if WE are the ones denying reality then those tens of millions who represent a large portion of the electoral college, may just be able to persuade enough of their friends to tip the electoral college scale.
At least that denial is behind us, except for the True Believers (in propaganda) and haters (of the deplorables). Someone KNEW that first debate had to be early. Too bad it couldn’t have been before the primaries. 🙂
June 29, 2024 at 7:55 am
Mitch
My commercial: Open on trump giving one of his Mussolini looks from the debate. Fades from color to black and white and freezes, as narrator says “Former Marine General John Kelly was Donald Trump’s Chief of Staff: ” and Kelly says “I can’t support him — he called America’s soldiers and veterans losers and suckers.” The narrator introduces ten or twenty more trump subordinates and each says “I can’t support him after…” At least two back up Kelly on trump’s statements about the military. Let it run for two minutes, long enough for people to realize it’s not just one or two people with a grudge. The last two seconds are just the Biden / Harris logo with Biden saying “I’m Joe Biden and I approved this message.” Run it everywhere all the time.
June 29, 2024 at 7:55 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
Mitch, in a clip I heard Biden say he was going to control rent. Did I hear that right? What do you think about that, was that a lie for the rubes?
June 29, 2024 at 7:59 am
Mitch
If I just said I’d vote for a pile of dogshit over trump, do you really think I give a flying fuck about Biden’s position on rent control? The fact is I think it is a policy that doesn’t work to benefit people who need affordable housing, while it does distort the price of a single asset. So I think it’s a mistake, exactly the sort of mistake that people who bury their heads in the sand make repeatedly, because it feels good to them and they refuse to ask whether it works.
June 29, 2024 at 8:00 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
I’m probably mostly done for the day. See you T-127. Happy beautiful Saturday all, enjoy and don’t let this sh*t get you down. Just do what you can to fix the God-forsaken planet from late-stage capitalism. 🙂
June 29, 2024 at 8:03 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
So he did say it? I’m more curious that if that is our platform how the hell he, or we, would do it. Clearly we couldn’t pass national legislation, would it be local grants from the executive office/. Part of a reconciliation budget process, what? Or was it a completely empty saying to try to address inflation talk in a debate.
June 29, 2024 at 8:11 am
Mitch
In a related question of equal relevance, what color were the seats on the airliners that crashed into the WTC.
June 29, 2024 at 8:39 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
You nailed it Mitch, this is the policy and even candidate-free election. Just vote against Trump and for the Democratic nominee. #BastionOfNeoliberalism
I couldn’t think of a better way to continue the Reagan era when so many are against what it’s producing and how we as people have lost our ability to use the very market place at the center of all out decisions to pay for food, shelter or even medicine. But most voters will have been able to pay the bills, so we are good. Just vote turd, or whatever it is that everyone else is voting for against the fascist.
June 29, 2024 at 8:43 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
Converts? Voters? Just get large donors to run an add over and over and please don’t forget to consult with Mitch or Rachel Bitecofer. This should satiate the rubes and defeat the lying liars and their ubiquitous 24/7/365 story-telling apparatus developed, innovated & optimized over decades.
https://x.com/rachelbitecofer/status/1806778914934804915
June 29, 2024 at 8:43 am
Anonymous
I have no problem with Biden stepping aside if it turns out that the debate really did hurt his standing in the polls.
And I agree it’s too soon to really assess the effect on the polls.
But for me that means it’s also too soon to call for Biden to definitely stay in the race, or definitely step aside. Seems like pretty obvious logic.
There’s a good reason that, at least so far, major Democratic leaders are not calling on Biden to step aside: As seasoned politicians they’re well aware that seemingly “big” developments with seemingly “obvious” political and public opinion effects don’t always turn out to have the effects that pundits — and especially Extremely Online social media commentators — are absolutely sure they’ll have in the immediate aftermath of those events.
So, while I’m sure plenty of these leaders are worried, they’re wise to wait for more data.
In the meantime people can speculate all they want about replacement scenarios and alternative candidates and so on. But don’t expect to see much of that from seasoned Democratic leaders. Not because they’re “in denial.” Because they’re experienced enough to know that knee-jerk reactions often lead to poor decisions, and because they’re smart enough to wait for strong data before making big moves.
In the meantime I’d recommend people not dig themsleves into such entrenched positions on this they — in either direction — that wind up in denial themselves, or otherwise having to make another abrupt about face, if the polling data that comes in doesn’t turn out the way they expect. Of course for some it may already be too late to avoid one or the other, because they’ve already made overly-definitive predictions based on gut reactions.
June 29, 2024 at 8:49 am
Mitch
Are you planning on voting for trump, Jon? Or do you expect the convention will nominate AOC? Do you understand what “binary” means? I know you do.
June 29, 2024 at 8:49 am
Mitch
As I recall, AOC was amazed at how much of the agenda she wanted Biden both fought for and got through.
June 29, 2024 at 8:50 am
Mitch
And I guess it needs to be pointed out again that for a short window, he was able to reduce child poverty in half, despite dealing with congress’ trump droids.
June 29, 2024 at 9:19 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
You know who I’m voting for as well as everyone here outside of Fullerton and possibly bolithio. That’s why I find it so weird for you to declare that you are voting for Trump. Of course, that’s never been the question, that’s not what changed in the seismic event that was Thursday night’s debate. The question is really two-fold afaic. A) How is it we got to the place JT is more credible than the rest of the media on the state of Biden’s health & competency and B) what are we going to do about it?
Voting for the Democratic turd opposing Trump is not in question for Democrats or #NeverTrumpers like yourself, but that might be the only well you can draw from right now so have at it. But Biden’s health will be a major issue in the election, and those saying it should be have been proven, by Joe Biden himself, right.
Do whatever risk analysis you all need to do and come up with a plan. If the plan is a great 30 second ad and attacking all those who don’t vote for Biden as NAZI sympathizers, fine, but just know that might not be enough.
And if we lose, I hope you remember the decision to play the best ads and the most ads and to call any hesitant to vote or care “Vichy” the best one your side came up with. And I hope you are OK taking at least some responsibility for that decision if we happen to lose if Biden’s health continues to be an issue.
June 29, 2024 at 9:30 am
Mitch
I’ve declared I’m voting for trump? If that’s humor, it escapes me. Perhaps it’s one of your quoted paraphrases.
June 29, 2024 at 9:32 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
Is there any chance we are going to pass national IVF protections in the next 2 years? No. We are likely going to lose the Senate and there is no way we are going to get the 60 votes we’d need. And that’s the lowest bar. We don’t want to talk about policy but aspirations for policy like rent control or even the lowest of low bars, protection, in all states, for IVF protections, we have no hope of passing via legislation.
Let’s just win that next election with the best expensive ads and continue this for those of in power as long as we can. Were much better than the alternative and no Democrat or even non-Democrat leftist can deny that, unless they are playing the accelerationist game.
June 29, 2024 at 9:32 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
Sorry, not voting for Trump.
June 29, 2024 at 9:33 am
Mitch
Oh, you probably mistyped and were confused that I asked you, rhetorically, whether you were going to vote for trump. But maybe not so rhetorically, if you now think of JT as Mr. Credibility. I agree Biden had a terrible night and it hurt the campaign to get rid of trump. But as I tried to make clear, I believe the race is between trump and not-trump, and most of the not-trump vote (and enthusiasm) is going to come from the need to prevent a dictator from ending the American experiment.
June 29, 2024 at 9:38 am
Mitch
And I’m still wondering what happened to Biden during that debate. I’m ready for any conspiracy theory. I no longer think I know anything about anything, so I’m perfectly ready to believe a trumper cook gave him food poisoning, or that the trump campaign used Russian technology to aim a thought-disruptor beam at him from one of the cameras. Maybe Netanyahu was angry at him for not backing him, and used an invisible space laser.
I’d like to see Biden at a press conference or in an unscripted interview, but I don’t think his demeanor at the debate is anything like his everyday demeanor. If it is, he should be convinced to step down. But I don’t have any reason to think it is.
June 29, 2024 at 9:40 am
Mitch
I do like the idea that he should do something unscripted sooner rather than later. It works either way. If he’s fine, he puts the debate to rest. If he’s not, we’re all entitled to know.
June 29, 2024 at 9:44 am
Mitch
And I appreciate John Fetterman’s summary of the NYT oped fleeing the ship. He’s concise and accurate.
June 29, 2024 at 10:02 am
Just Trollin
…..”I’d vote for a pile of dogshit running against trump“.
Just bide your time mitchie. You’ll get your chance…..
June 29, 2024 at 10:25 am
Just Trollin
Speaking to Jill from the grave…..
June 29, 2024 at 10:40 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
I no longer think I know anything about anything, so I’m perfectly ready to believe a trumper cook gave him food poisoning, or that the trump campaign used Russian technology to aim a thought-disruptor beam at him from one of the cameras
This is why I asked if you are OK. He’s aged, elderly, old. This is what happens to us as we grow old and I for one am totally OK forgiving the debate and all those clips JT keeps posting because …spoilers…that’s what happens to us as we age. (And I’d consider myself lucky to make it to Biden’s age)
I’ve said this before, but this makes him a sympathetic figure, as long as he assures us publicly that a) he knows he is capable of being President and b) the moment he questions this himself he will pass this touch to the most capable VP the country has ever had and c) this transition shall not be a big deal, it’s just a part of the way our government works.
In short, what you as the U.S. public are doing in November (t-128 days) is voting for the Democrat & his VP who voters across the country have recertified as their choice to fight for big D Democratic values and against Republican values, (and if you’d like, especially those of a felon, fascist, and whatever other names you’d like to add…impeached, I forgot impeached).
June 29, 2024 at 10:49 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
But if you don’t trust the public to be sympathetic, despite all the evidence like voting for Fetterman himself, then fine, 1) ignore aging, 2) call JT’s video’s fake news and Biden fine except for when Trump poisons him 3) carpet-bomb the airwaves with Biden being healthy, standing & talking and 4) call those Democrats that can’t help but point out the obvious Nazi sympathizers and let’s roll the dice that we are more credible than the actual lying liars to those who won’t show up or who will vote for Kennedy or Trump instead. At least on one subject, arguably the most important of all we won’t be.
June 29, 2024 at 10:54 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
And if it’s Trump vs not-Trump don’t forget there is another not-Trump and you are going to also have to explain why you are going to have to vote for the guy Trump poisoned just to win.
June 29, 2024 at 11:23 am
Just Trollin
This whole biden collapse sets up the scenario where Kennedy pulls far more votes from biden than Trump. democrats who can’t bring themselves to vote for biden will still feel like they’re voting for a “democrat”….
June 29, 2024 at 11:27 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
Mr Credibility ain’t wrong and if our message is simply vote against Trump and we don’t establish a reason to vote FOR Biden (other than he is the only one that can win in a 2 party system and we’ll have to explain that too in that perfect ad) then votes could go to Kennedy.
June 29, 2024 at 1:13 pm
Mr. Credibility
Mr. Credibility. I like it !
June 30, 2024 at 4:21 am
Just Trollin
Based on his N.C. rally, it appears magoo’s strategy is to bring back the screaming “get off my lawn” old man. And democrats asking “where was that Joe” during the debate, they already know the answer….. teleprompter…..
June 30, 2024 at 6:15 am
humboldturtle
A local pol once told me Eric’s blog is where discussion goes to die. Spiro Agnew said it: “the nattering nabobs of negativism” have formed “their own 4-H Club – the ‘hopeless, hysterical hypochondriacs of history.’” You guys and the New York Times.
June 30, 2024 at 6:23 am
NoWorries
From this morning’s WaPo:
“After last night’s debate, he said, ‘You know, Jill, I don’t know what happened. I didn’t feel that great,’” she recounted. “And I said, ‘Look, Joe, we are not going to let 90 minutes define the four years that you’ve been president.’”
And there you have the choice spelled out by the principals. MSNBC reported this a.m. the family circle, and only the family circle, is meeting @ Camp David. Speculation abounds about the outcome – if any announced – from that meeting.
June 30, 2024 at 7:00 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
I’ll count you turtle in on the forced collective delusion. If you all hadn’t been Thursday would have been just another normal day with Biden having one of his bad nights. Either that of]r it would have been Harris up there or who ever won the primary. Whatever, the question is what do we do going forward and your answer is turtle? Stick out heads in the sand and call those who don’t Nazi sympathizers? T – 127.
June 30, 2024 at 7:08 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
betting oddsmakers, what 538 calls the kids in Scotland I think, have Trump at 65% chance right now which I’m sure includes Biden being alive on Nov 5th. Sorry to be morbid but that, and competency is what Thursday & JT’s videos bring into question.
Right now the 538 forecast itself has it at 50/50.
June 30, 2024 at 7:16 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
btw, it’s not just the NYT editorial board that has asked Biden to step down, it’s the New Yorker now too.
Whoa — the Editor of the @NewYorker just joined th Editorial Board of the @nytimes in calling upon #JoeBiden to stand down and let another Democrat run for POTUS.
What do you say, America? Are you buying this? – Laurie Garret
You’ll surely appreciate this tho turtle Philadelphia Inquirer editorialized that Donald Trump should stand down…
The Philly Inquirer with the complete and total own of the quisling Vichy NYT.
https://x.com/tomwatson/status/1807243536611336264
June 30, 2024 at 7:28 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
No lies detected…
Voters think Biden is too old. Journalists think Biden is too old. Behind the scenes, Democratic officials think Biden is too old. Beyond risking a loss, Biden is contributing to the feeling nothing matters. He is corroding the faith in politics he promised to restore.–
Even if a replacement candidate went on to lose to Trump, that loss would be better than a Biden one. If Biden stays on, the Democratic Party will spend the next several months lying to itself and the American people in a way that will damage its standing in the long run. – Osita Nwanevu
https://x.com/ositanwanevu/status/1806693133683425373
June 30, 2024 at 7:30 am
Anonymous
Jon is going to be so sad if Biden wins.
June 30, 2024 at 7:41 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
This debate making abundantly clear that Biden’s insistence on running for another term – when 66% of voters in our swing state poll believe it’s likely he won’t be able to finish a second term – has gravely jeopardized Dems’ prospects to defeat Trump.
First rule of campaigns: you have to meet voters where they are, not you wish they were. And you can’t tell voters not to see what they’re seeing. -Dave Wasserman
Where are the “just listen to your constituents, go door to door” Democrats now?
https://x.com/redistrict/status/1806510880030331322
June 30, 2024 at 7:52 am
humboldturtle
“Abundantly clear” because people think Biden will kick before the end of his next term? Good one.
June 30, 2024 at 7:56 am
humboldturtle
Male life expectancy at age 78 is 8 years.
Male life expectancy at age 81 is 7 years.
June 30, 2024 at 8:06 am
Carol Conners
We are not just voting for one person, We are voting for an entire administration. The Biden Harris campaign just brought in lots of money. Let’s make lemonade out of lemons! Stay Calm and Carry On!
June 30, 2024 at 8:22 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
The problem is Carol, we can’t say that. We should, but we can’t, what we have to do instead is lie. I can’t stand being lied to and I know many other Americans can’t either.
I’m OK, as I always am, voting for the party that says we don’t lie, even if our top-of-ticket candidate is suffering cognitive decline, but let’s have the President speak to that, tell us how and when he will step down and what would trigger it and put it behind us.
Carol, part of the reason this is so frustrating to me is I remember how we responded when Reagan was President and was clearly suffering cognitive decline. We didn’t give him any grace when perhaps we should have if I’m understanding this all correctly. We voted in a Republican Administration and maybe it was unseemly of us then to call out Reagan as we did.
Honesty & consistency for ourselves and our political opponents. (Aka, the golden rule, even (or especially) in politics)
June 30, 2024 at 8:25 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
Not finishing a term because he wasn’t able to doesn’t mean he “kicked it” turtle. Or does it to you? That’s perhaps even more frightening trying to imagine what that might mean.
June 30, 2024 at 8:50 am
humboldturtle
Kicked. Croaked. Passed Away…
June 30, 2024 at 8:56 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
Even worse than being lied to is being expected to propagate the lie, even with my silence and that is what we are being asked to do Carol.
June 30, 2024 at 9:21 am
Just Trollin
I bet Jill thought her days of baby sitting a biden were over….
June 30, 2024 at 10:21 am
Mitch
Carol Conners sums up my feelings about the Presidency.
The election, less so. But if America’s voters votes in trump, then America is the sort of country in which a majority of the voters will vote for a racist, sexist, narcissistic, sexual-abusing, continually-lying convicted felon for President and Commander in Chief, and trump being President won’t change that about America. So I guess my hopeful fantasy is that America has not become that sort of country.
June 30, 2024 at 10:23 am
Mitch
Eight years ago it was possible to pretend people didn’t understand what he was. That’s no longer possible.
June 30, 2024 at 10:34 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
Wait, so for Democrats we are voting for an administration but for Republicans they are voting for the top of ticket?
See how quickly logic gets pretzeled if you start lying to yourself? And the lie is simply this, Joe Biden is mentally competent to be President 24/7 and that we have a plan in place if he is not.
June 30, 2024 at 10:38 am
Jon Yalcinkaya
I’ve never held it against someone voting for Trump for the same reason I won’t hold it against any Democrat voting for Biden even if they know he is not competent to be President.
It’s also the reason why I would have voted for John Edwards if he was our only choice. You can boil the reasons why we all would/should vote for the party who best represents our values, even imperfectly down to one reason: SCOTUS, but there are tens if not hundreds of other reasons to do so, for BOTH sides.
June 30, 2024 at 10:55 am
Anonymous
Nobody here is asking you to “lie,” Jon, or to propagate any “lies.” Other people have different assessments of the situation than you do, that doesn’t mean they’re “lying,” much less asking you to. It’s a tough situation, being melodramatic about it doesn’t help.
June 30, 2024 at 10:56 am
Mitch
I guess you haven’t noticed what’s become of the Republican Party.
June 30, 2024 at 11:02 am
Anonymous
The best evidence that Biden is competent to be President, is that he’s president and has handled the presidency quite competently.
If that was to change and he were to become “incompetent” to carry out his duties, the “plan” is right there in the Constitution: the President can step down and be replaced by the Vice President, and if he doesn’t do so voluntarily, the cabinet can remove him via the 25th Amendment. There is no mystery about how any of that works.
June 30, 2024 at 12:27 pm
Anonymous
Helpful flow chart:
If you call on Biden to step aside =>
Name your ideal replacement =>
If Harris, OK. (Done.)
If not Harris =>
-Explain in great detail the process in which that person is nominated.
-Explain how the D coalition doesn’t crumble if the first Black woman VP is passed over.
https://x.com/admcrlsn/status/1807447590675320938
June 30, 2024 at 12:50 pm
Anonymous
I’m skeptical Biden will step aside short of a big drop in the polls, and I think that’s probably the right call, but if you want to game out what happens if he does, then unless something changes pretty dramatically, I think it’s a pretty quick game.
https://x.com/blkprofcct/status/1807496643736150426
June 30, 2024 at 1:52 pm
Just Trollin
Everyone ignored it until they couldn’t….
June 30, 2024 at 3:57 pm
Anonymous
Wait, so for Democrats we are voting for an administration but for Republicans they are voting for the top of ticket?
It’s genuinely funny that Jon thinks this constitutes “pretzeled” logic, as opposed to a pretty accurate summary of the situation. The GOP has largely become The Party of Trump.
If the Democratic Party was a cult of personality like the GOP is these days, there would be no talk whatsoever about Biden stepping aside.
June 30, 2024 at 5:39 pm
Henchman Of Justice
My guess is if Biden is replaced, it is with Harris…who then chooses Sanders as VP…
July 1, 2024 at 6:43 am
Henchman Of Justice
…average american lifespan is 78-81 years old…so half a decade of credited senility maturity gets deducted from the adults when breaking down the first 18 years of life before voting rights “kick in go on green”… to suggest that even 84 is way too old to serve in government!
69 + 18 = 89 less 5 equals 84…
July 1, 2024 at 6:45 am
Henchman Of Justice
87 less 5 = 82… coffee…still…needed…lol, my head up my ass!