Proposition 19 – Yes.
I know it’s not written well, and it’ll probably be overturned by federal supremacy. But if it doesn’t pass, it will be interpreted as a mandate against legalization and set the movement back five years minimum.
Proposition 20 – No
This would establish a 14-member non-elected California Citizens Redistricting Commission to take the partisanship out of the Congressional redistricting process and in theory prevent gerrymandering. There would be an equal number of Democrats and Republicans. The problem is that Democratic Party majority states such as Illinois keep passing these reforms while sleazoids like Tom Delay continue to gerrymander to ridiculous proportions in places like Texas and Oklahoma. California has the biggest delegation and this will have an enormous impact benefiting Republicans at the national level. I wouldn’t object so much if similar measures were being simultaneously passed in the red states.
Proposition 21 – Yes
This would restore the vehicle licensing fee amounts to the benefit of the park system by $18.00 per year. As an incentive, the measure also offers free entrance to the state parks. I consider fees of this nature to be regressive taxes, so I tend to oppose them, but this will save the park system.
Proposition 22 – No
The measure would keep municipal redevelopment funds local, which sounds good, but it would deprive the state of the ability to reallocate all of its resources in times of fiscal emergency, and that will be a detriment to everything from state highways to education.
A side note, this measure applies only to cities, not counties. That means if the cities don’t cough up their cash, they’ll take even more from those living in unincorporated areas.
Proposition 23 – Big No!
This is about oil companies freaking out about Assembly Bill 32, California’s Global Warming Solutions Act, which imposes enforceable limits on greenhouse gas emissions by 2012. Basically it prevents the act from materializing until the state’s unemployment rate has been under 5.5 percent for a year.
Proponents say that the new regs will kill jobs. Opponents say that California’s infrastructure is at the point where a green boost could actually increase jobs, which runs counter to the prevailing economics narrative of the past 30 years. The argument has taken prominence in the Governor’s race. Is it a job killer, or stimulative? In any case, the oil companies picked a perfect time to push this as everyone is jittery about jobs. But there’s no consensus among economists. Ironically, there are a number of business interests outside of the oil industry which oppose this thing, because investors have been working towards the transition for some time now.
Proposition 24 – Yes
In order to pass a recent budget Democrats had to concede some “reforms” of taxes which allow companies to share tax credits with subsidiaries and related businesses and greatly expanded the ability of businesses to spread credits for losses over many years even those which are profitable. This measure would essentially repeal those provisions and re-establish firm criteria for determining the income of multistate businesses. The estimate is that it will restore 1.7 billion in revenue. The opposition consists of the usual whining that businesses will leave California, but they’ve sung that song for decades now and being on the Pacific Rim, California is going to be a desired business location regardless. Besides, can you attract the best employees if you relocate to Nevada? Who wants to live there?
Proposition 25 – Big yes!
Would put an end to the gridlock which has cost the state billions by reducing the vote threshold to pass a budget and budget related matters from two thirds to a simple majority. Long, long overdue!
As an added perk legislators would lose their salaries on a daily basis until it passes. The losses would not be made up.
It does not, by the way, reduce the two-thirds majority to pass taxes – which would be fine with me.
Proposition 26 – No
This would require a two thirds majority for any local increases in fees, levies, charges, and any revenue not currently defined as taxes. As I’ve said, fees tend to be regressive, but it would make it impossible for local governments to raise money. Think Measure L. It would have failed under Prop. 26.
Proposition 27 – Yes
This would basically dissolve the Redistricting Commission created by proposition in 2008 and restore the responsibility to the legislature – it was the state district version of this year’s Prop 20. I’m not in favor of non-elected panels anyway, and I especially want accountability in something so important. All the same reasons I oppose Prop 20.
….
Over the weekend I’ll post my candidate endorsements. I may have a surprise or two.
….
Thanks to John Rogers for this link. It’s a chart of various political organizations from left to right with their ballot prop endorsements.

82 comments
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October 15, 2010 at 9:25 pm
Anonymous
You support 25? I am shocked! Simply shocked!
October 16, 2010 at 6:34 am
Mitch
Thanks, Eric. I’m surprised by your position on 20, but it’s very understandable.
October 16, 2010 at 7:36 am
ED Denson
I don’ t think the Feds get to control the laws of the State, and so Prop 19 will not be overturned. However, the states rights issue was lost some 150 years ago, so Federal law will remain in place even if in opposition to the express wishes of the people. In other words Marijuana will not be illegal under California law, but it will under Federal law.
October 16, 2010 at 7:40 am
the reasonable anonymous
Of course the feds don’t have even a fraction of the law enforcement resources they would need in order to make even a small dent in the growers, much less to enforce possession laws. In other words they will “vigorously enforce” the law against maybe one one-millionth of the pot users and growers in California, nowhere near enough to make any difference whatsoever, but plenty enough for some photo ops. If it wasn’t such a waste of resources, it would be laughable.
October 16, 2010 at 7:56 am
Mitch
tra,
It’s more than a waste of resources. It will be a textbook case of selective prosecution. When you only enforce the law against 0.01% of the offenders, you can rest assure that the law is a cover for political harassment.
October 16, 2010 at 7:59 am
the reasonable anonymous
A commenter on Heraldo’s blog makes an interesting point:
“I am wondering if this will actually help Humboldt County stay afloat economically if 19 passes? Big tobacco companies who would love to have a piece of mj productions in California may not grow as they would be an easy federal target. That means if Humboldt growers remain small enough to stay off of the federal radar, Humboldt County can still have its cash economy and not be taken over by the big tobacco companies who would love a huge piece of this economic pie”
October 16, 2010 at 8:05 am
the reasonable anonymous
I suppose it might also throw a damper on plans for huge non-medical commercial grows in Oakland (and elsewhere) that many Humboldt growers cite as their reason for opposing Prop 19. So I suppose that might be the silver lining from a strictly local, strictly economic point of view…
Obama’s planned “crackdown” is still an idiotic policy approach, of course, but I can see how it might actually be welcome idiocy from the point of view of smallish local growers who might anticipate more potential customers (thanks to the state backing off on possession and transport) but in a “protected market” where the Feds would still be providing price support by eliminating the largest growers.
In other words, did Obama just win a few more votes for Prop 19 among Humboldt growers!?
October 16, 2010 at 8:07 am
Mitch
tra,
The RJRs of the world don’t need to be scared off by threats of federal enforcement. It’s sufficient that it’s illegal. Corporations don’t bet their businesses on illegal industries or even controversial ones — that’s why RJR isn’t running brothels in Nevada.
This, like DADT, is just the Obama administration stupidly continuing to take its friends for granted while thinking it’s earning votes from its enemies, which is pure fantasy. Obama could quote Newt Gingrich chapter and book, and he’d still have dark skin.
October 16, 2010 at 8:08 am
the reasonable anonymous
Mitch,
Re: selective enforcement…very true.
And in terms of possession, I expect that it would be more like .0000001%
October 16, 2010 at 8:17 am
the reasonable anonymous
“This, like DADT, is just the Obama administration stupidly continuing to take its friends for granted while thinking it’s earning votes from its enemies…”
Well I’m not sure about the “thinking it’s earning votes from its enemies” part — I think that their hope is to win more votes from “moderates,” and “swing voters” than they might lose from their own base (which I agree they take for granted, because they see the Dem base as having “nowhere else to go”).
I’m not sure that Obama’s team are dumb enough to think they are winning over Republicans, but they do seem dumb enough to not realize that for every swing voter they pull in with a dumb move like this, they may lose 2 or 3 base voters…not to the Republicans, but to nonvoting.
October 16, 2010 at 8:23 am
Anonymous
feds trump states, always, it will be different if you get busted now, and are charged with a state crime, or if you get busted then and get charged with a federal crime.
like the LA county sheriff said, he follows federal law, and thinks he’ll get a whole lot of overtime if 19 passes. so much for saving the state money, and for the less enforcement idea.
October 16, 2010 at 8:31 am
Anonymous
i should also add on prop 19, if it fails, it will not fail as a mandate on legal pot, you are wrong on that. it will fail because people get it for the poor piece of legislation that it is. i for one, am voting no because of that reason.like it says you can smoke in your house, good, then it says if you smoke around kids, felony, what if you are a parent, and smoke at home? felony? also, the feds have basically turned a blind eye to the medical marijuana issue under obama, might not happen if a repuglican gets the helm next time. i don’t believe in “thumbing your nose” at anyone, or biting off more than one can chew, as 19 seems to be.
October 16, 2010 at 10:03 am
Low Finances
You forgot . NO on the drunken alcoholics ….LaVallee & Kuhnel or maybe you did not forget because you already knew that . One look at their stomachs from all the DRUGS they do tells me they won’t get my vote .
October 16, 2010 at 10:32 am
moviedad
I don’t think 19 will pass. When you factor in the Orange counties, and the eastern side of the state, it won’t make it. But let’s say it does. There is no way it won’t end up in court. Think of all the propositions that passed in election, but died in court. The open primary law of 1996 (?) comes to mind.
Perhaps it is just cynicism, but the rulers are very aware of the influence pot has on California’s economy. I don’t see them killing the golden goose on the pretext of the immorality of prosecuting small time growers and users. Pot offenders get pretty stiff sentences compared to other misdemeanor convictions. Reading the ‘Sentencings” section of the Sunday paper is a real eye-opener.
And for me, Jerry Brown has got to win. If he doesn’t, and big-money gets their candidates in throughout the country, then we, as a people are totally screwed. The only good side of it, will be the hastening of “Real” uprising against the ruling class. But then again, with the total lock they have on all media, I don’t see that coming anytime soon. America as a republic and a democracy; died when the capitalist court ruled on “Citizens United.” We’ll see if the country survives as a whole entity. or whether the rich-Super-Citizens, break it up into smaller, easier to control fiefdoms. I expect the Tea-Partiers to wake up late. the Dupes are always the last to know.
After the House-Slave betrays all his brothers to the master. he comes to realize too late, that he is no better off for turning in his people to the ruling class. He is no better off, he is still a slave; he just gets to wear better clothes.
October 16, 2010 at 10:41 am
moviedad
Good point Mitch. You’ve described Obama’s whole presidency. He used the progressive and liberals to get elected and immediately went to work for his true masters. I do not want appear racist by associating Obama with my analogy of the house slave. but it fits in that his people are not just black Americans, but all of us that took a chance on his rhetoric. I’m still bugged that I was talked into giving him my Cynthia McKinney vote. Just like I was talked into giving Gore my “Ralph” vote. This next time I will vote my conscience.
October 16, 2010 at 11:56 am
Low Finances
Judges fed up with drunken violence clogging our courts
Geesche Jacobsen, Joel Gibson and Deborah Snow
October 17, 2010
Chief Magistrate Graeme Henson… publicans’ blame of illicit drugs is “self-serving”.
Chief Magistrate Graeme Henson… publicans’ blame of illicit drugs is “self-serving”. Photo: Brendan Esposito
JUDGES and magistrates in NSW are appalled at the epidemic level of alcohol-fuelled crime in their courts, which accounts for more than half of their work and includes violence they never imagined when they started on the bench.
They revealed their concerns as part of an investigation involving 22 on-the-record interviews with judges and magistrates.
Alcohol plays a role in 50 to 60 per cent of the nearly 300,000 criminal cases that come before the state’s Local Courts each year, Chief Magistrate Graeme Henson said.
Advertisement: Story continues below
”The proliferation of alcohol in the community is obvious. We went from 10 o’clock closing to a different environment,” he said.
Another judge, who did not want to be named, said: ”This city, which should otherwise be a sophisticated city, is largely run by a handful of hoteliers.
”The violence here is just extraordinary. You see it all the time. The wounds, the significant wounding that occurs on the weekend in the city is quite extraordinary.”
Crime statistics show about 43,000 alcohol-related assaults and incidents of offensive behaviour last year – 4700 of them in the Sydney local government area. (Each incident can generate a number of charges, and other crimes, including property damage, are often related to alcohol.)
October 16, 2010 at 12:18 pm
Low Finances
Didn’t Kuhnel say he would be serving cocktail , beer and wine at his political benefit ?
Is this who we need to run our City ?
October 16, 2010 at 12:55 pm
Not A Native
I was planning to vote the opposite way on 20 and 27 and I’ll look again but your explanation of 20 is confusing to me now. Are you saying that CA should retain a biased process in retaliation for the other states doing it. That sounds like a child justifying having a privilege because ‘all the other kids do it’. I don’t think that’s a sufficient reason.
October 16, 2010 at 1:06 pm
Mitch
NaN,
Eric’s logic seems exactly the same as the logic of those who argue for campaign finance reform but continue to accept large donations as long as their opponents do. You can be for disarmament but recognize the futility of unilateral disarmament.
October 16, 2010 at 2:40 pm
Eric Kirk
I don’ t think the Feds get to control the laws of the State, and so Prop 19 will not be overturned. However, the states rights issue was lost some 150 years ago, so Federal law will remain in place even if in opposition to the express wishes of the people. In other words Marijuana will not be illegal under California law, but it will under Federal law.
Ed, so far the Federal government has not attempted to force the issue as to whether the Supremacy Clause requires state law enforcement to enforce Federal Law as well as state law. The Gonzales case has me concerned particularly with Scalia willing to ditch federalism for result-oriented drug rulings. On the other hand, the issue for the four liberals was the integrity broad interpretation of the commerce clause to maintain the civil rights, labor, and environmental laws, and I don’t think that such a ruling forcing state authority to enforce federal law is required for that purpose. But they’re jittery about anything which would remove that power from the federal government, though I really think it’s a stretch that a 10th Amendment ruling on marijuana would have overturned the Civil Rights Act.
In any case, I hope I’m wrong.
October 16, 2010 at 2:41 pm
Eric Kirk
Didn’t Kuhnel say he would be serving cocktail , beer and wine at his political benefit ?
Is this who we need to run our City ?
Is there a strong contingent of pro-alcohol prohibition voters in Eureka?
October 16, 2010 at 2:42 pm
Eric Kirk
Thanks, Eric. I’m surprised by your position on 20, but it’s very understandable.
I’m not against it in principle in a more perfect world. If they pass it in Texas, I’ll be happy to vote for it here.
October 16, 2010 at 2:52 pm
Eric Kirk
I’m actually kind of curious as to how Southern Humboldt will vote on props 22 and 25. We’ve got an odd mix of liberal politics with “don’t tread on me” libertarianism which doesn’t like to pay taxes, and I’m never quite sure how we’ll fall on these issues.
October 16, 2010 at 2:56 pm
Anonymous
Pro – Alcohol prohibition ?
Prohibit means ; to ban , prohibit
Pro means to favor / are for
Please explain , Eric since we have 3 candidates running for political positions here in , Eureka with ties to drugs ( Alcohol ) of which two are known boozers & we know who those two are . The other pushes and sells the stuff . Can you help me out on your statement ?
October 16, 2010 at 3:01 pm
mresquan
“Didn’t Kuhnel say he would be serving cocktail , beer and wine at his political benefit ?
Is this who we need to run our City ?”
Is it Ron’s fault if you can’t control your own alcohol intake?
October 16, 2010 at 3:28 pm
Eric Kirk
Please explain , Eric since we have 3 candidates running for political positions here in , Eureka with ties to drugs ( Alcohol ) of which two are known boozers & we know who those two are . The other pushes and sells the stuff . Can you help me out on your statement ?
I don’t know who the “boozers” are, but I don’t think most Eureka voters are going to hold it against Kuhnel that he served drinks at a fundraiser. Are the Newman fund raisers Teetotaler events?
October 16, 2010 at 9:43 pm
Anonymous
Just what I live for, Eric’s election recomendations.
Guess it’s a good thing I vote absentee ballot
October 17, 2010 at 2:00 am
Mr. Nice
That’s only gonna be a misdemeanor bruh bruh. It’s not a felony until you front kids weed to sell at school. Any law that says max $1,000 fine and 6 months in jail is not a felony. The court won’t even have any smoking weed “in the presence of a minor” cases as a misdemeanor because people would go to court and fight it and the shit would be a mess. Folks will plead guilty to some other shit and get fined $100. Besides all that, the cops would actually have to catch you in the act smoking weed in the presence of a minor. You’d have to be in your place and the cops busting the door at random then oh shit look a 17 year old kid is on your couch, you’re under arrest. Only stupid, stupid people will get charged with this smoking in front of a minor law, seriously.
I swear has nobody ever been to court over this shit? Getting popped selling less than an ounce in California will only be a fine and a misdemeanor no matter what. The bitch is they take will take all your cash and say the money is evidence in connection with a crime right down to your $1.25 in change while all you got left is a grainy photocopy of it. Usually the cash seizure is more expensive than anything else.
Basically, if they pass this Prop 19 shit, folks will be able to possess an ounce and go buy that ounce from someone else no problem. The worst that a cop could do is try to fine the dealer and take his cash as is what already happens anyway.
If a city decides to license it then the dealer can send a check in every year and we can end this whole formality of going to court to settle it.
October 17, 2010 at 9:48 am
Low finances
Yes , it is Ron’s fault . I would never vote for him because he’s essentially a drug pusher . One thing for sure he better quit drinking his deadly drug called alcohol before he gets diabetes , cirrhosis of the liver , a stroke or a heart attack . I hope this doesn’t happen but he’s bound to end up with serious health problems if he doesn’t stop drinking . Through his ignorance he’s already closed down medical marijuana dispensaries but does nothing to close down liquor stores , pharmacies and bars which are the real culrpits when it comes to crime .The Police are out there doing DUI stops because of Alcohol . They know the seriousness of what Alcohol can do to impair driving . How many impaired drivers did , Ron create by pushing these drugs at his benefit ?
October 17, 2010 at 9:58 am
Low finances
sorry i meant ” how many impaired drivers did , Ron create by SERVING THESE DRUGS at his benefit ” ? .
This is what is meant as ” Lawlessness ” .
October 17, 2010 at 10:10 am
Low finances
The other week i watched a program on TV & it was called , ” Over the Limit “.
I saw nearly a full 30 minutes of Law Enforcement Officials & Police Officers being kicked , spit at , shouted at , hit and beat because of they were under the influence of Alcohol . I also saw car accidents resulting in death & injuries because of liquor and i saw DUI arrests .
Do we really need someone who ” Tastes ” or promotes Alcohol in , Eureka or anywhere else in California ?
October 17, 2010 at 11:44 am
Anonymous
Thank you very much Eric. I don’t agree with everything but this is helpful.
October 17, 2010 at 4:02 pm
the reasonable anonymous
I guess Kuhnel better watch out for the voter backlash from that potent bloc of votes composed of “Low Finances” and the Women’s Christian Temperence League. Heh.
October 17, 2010 at 4:06 pm
Eric Kirk
I think Low Finance is pulling our legs.
October 17, 2010 at 7:55 pm
Not A Native
I looked over the prop 20/27 issue and firmly have come down in favor of 20 and opposed to 27.
The argument that California representatives will have less seniority and influence in Washington becuse of fairer districting is hollow because as the most populous State and one with significant and unique human and resource attributes, California pulls a lot of weight in Congress compared to many less populous and less resource rich States. California influence will continue under prop 20, even if committe chairs are elsewhere. And as a largely Democrat, California already has less influence whenever Republicans are in leadership.
And I have hopes that under prop 20 high performing California representatives will be reelected and gain seniority in a meritorious way rather than by rigging elections. Ahh, the audacity of hope!!
Basically, I think California is in a good political position to be among the first to more fairly redistrict. And I believe, a less corrupt election system will result iin better solutions and programs being developed by politicians. That will further differentiate and enhance California from other States. If not us, then who? If not now, then when?
October 17, 2010 at 8:13 pm
Mr. Nice
Low finances is either tryna be J.D. or is. Prolly is.
Nothing wrong with promoting alcohol, alcohol advertising… from using Bud with bikini girls and Spuds MacKenzie to Sam Adams with Spike Lee.
Weed just needs to be sold in liquor stores as an alternative to alcohol even if it has to be as a vitamin supplement or a novelty item or some other pseudo-legitimate liquor store type thing.
Exactly what did Ron Kuhnel do about dispensaries? I know few of those politicians have done shit to help.
October 17, 2010 at 8:20 pm
Eric Kirk
The argument that California representatives will have less seniority and influence in Washington becuse of fairer districting is hollow because…
I don’t think you understand the proposition or the argument NAN. This isn’t term limits. It’s not about seniority. It’s about fewer Democrats in Congress and more Republicans. That will be the result – bottom line.
As for who and when, quite frankly I don’t think gerrymandering is all that serious of a problem. It does lead to some weirdly shaped districts, but so what?
If Texas and Florida put similar measures up simultaneously, then I may be ready to support it. But right now it’s just another liberal power giveaway to Republicans, and we’ve had enough of those in recent history.
October 17, 2010 at 8:46 pm
Mr. Nice
The CaGOP voters guide, Chuck DeVore, and NAN came to the same conclusion.
I’m voting like you Erik. Simple point on 20 is it redistricts by income level. That seems racist. I voted against 11 too because seriously funding 14 random people to redistrict sounds stupid no matter how they dress it up.
October 17, 2010 at 8:56 pm
Eric Kirk
I’m also not convinced that the body will be truly independent. They may not gerrymander on behalf of one party, but they will probably orient their districting to benefit incumbents in general.
In any case, NAN is entitled to his/her opinion, although there is a certain irony in that NAN was questioning my progressive credentials a few weeks ago.
October 18, 2010 at 2:59 pm
Not A Native
What is the basis for the assertion that redistricting per prop 20 will necessarily result in more Republicans and fewer Democrats? I’d like to see the details of the rationale, not just sound bites and scary anecdotes.
Eric you’re no progressive, you’re a BOBO. The NAACP, Common Cause, and S.F. Chronicle are in favor of prop 20. In truth, conservative and liberal entities are both in favor of prop 20, the primary oppositiion is from incumbent politicians.
October 18, 2010 at 7:05 pm
Mr. Nice
The prop 20 shit is Frisco politics at its finest.
No offense to the NAACP, the Hispanic 100, the Black Women Organized for Political Action, and the Organization of Chinese Americans but they just want a separate voting district for Hunter’s Point, Mission and Chinatown than Nob Hill and shit. I guess that is cool but who knows what the fuck kind of crazy person the white people will vote in if they aren’t kept in check. I mean we got Pelosi already and some people think that is crazy… imagine if they found some politician who was truly nutty.
I prolly should stay out of this having voted against 11.
Libertarian says no opinion
Republican party: yes
Democrat: no
(insert organization) of San Francisco: yes
I don’t understand why they gotta fuck around with the districts at all.
October 18, 2010 at 10:07 pm
Eric Kirk
What is the basis for the assertion that redistricting per prop 20 will necessarily result in more Republicans and fewer Democrats? I’d like to see the details of the rationale, not just sound bites and scary anecdotes.
Because Democrats currently gerrymander the districts to maximize Democratic seats, as the majority party does in every state. That’s the whole rationale for the initiative NAN, to prevent the Democrats from gerrymandering, or the Republicans if they ever achieved a majority. If it’s not the case, then what’s the point of the measure?
Again, I don’t think you really understand the proposition.
I’ve never been particularly impressed with Common Cause by the way.
Here is a list of opponents to Prop 20 taken from the no on 20 site.
* The League of Women Voters says “NO ON PROP 20.”
“[T]ucked into the proposed law are problems … it would narrow the definition of communities of interest in ways that would make it harder for the commission to protect California’s diverse neighborhoods.”
* The California State Firefighters’ Association (CSFA) says “NO ON PROP 20; YES ON PROP 27.”
“What are the politicians thinking? Unemployment is 12.4%! We are drowning in a sea of debt. And the Sacramento politicians are wasting money on yet another bureaucracy. Send the Sacramento Politicians a message! No on 20; Yes on 27.”
* Zev Yaroslavsky – Los Angeles County Supervisor, 3rd District
“Our Community is united against Prop 20 and for Prop 27. What are they thinking? Unemployment is 12.4%! We are drowning in a sea of debt. And their solution is to give even more power to a bureaucracy that wastes millions of taxpayer dollars. The Democratic Party official endorsement: No on 20; Yes on 27.”
* The Sacramento Bee says “NO ON PROP 20.”
“[P]roposition 20 doesn’t have … broad support. It is largely the work of Charles Munger Jr., son of a Wall Street billionaire, who has poured at least $3.7 million into the campaign … No on 20 …”
“… reform needs to happen on the national level…California’s interests could be harmed … No on 20 …”
* The California Teachers Association says “NO ON PROP 20.”
“CTA urges a Yes vote on Proposition 27 and a No on Proposition 20. California needs to eliminate unnecessary bureaucracy and return to a fair system for deciding our representative districts. Proposition 27 will save money — funds that could be used for our students. We need to reject Proposition 20 — a flawed measure that creates another unnecessary new bureaucracy. Let’s hold our legislature accountable- Yes on 27 and No on 20.”
# The California Nurses Association says “NO ON PROP 20; YES ON PROP 27.”
Proposition 20 is a billionaire’s cynical attempt to remove the staunchest supporters of nurses and quality health care in Congress. Proposition 27 will save taxpayer dollars better spent on essential services. No on 20 & Yes on 27.”
* The California League of Conservation Voters says “NO ON PROP 20; YES ON PROP 27.”
“When the process is in danger of being hijacked in a way that will hurt the environment, the California League of Conservation Voters must act. Prop. 20 takes power from the people and gives it to a new bureaucracy that is not accountable to the people. Prop. 27 repeals the redistricting scheme that endangers our pro-environment champions! No on 20 and Yes on 27.”
# Sierra Club Chairman Carl Pope says “NO ON PROP 20.”
“When the process is in danger of being hijacked in a way that will hurt the environment, the Sierra Club must act. The Sierra Club therefore urges California voters to vote No on Prop 20″
# NAACP Chairman Emeritus Julian Bond says “NO ON PROP 20.”
“Prop 20 is insulting to all Californians. Jim Crow districts are a thing of the past. 20 sets back the clock on redistricting law. No on 20″
* Mexican American Legal Defense & Education Fund Chairman Thomas Saenz says “NO ON PROP 20.”
Note that Thomas Saenz was the lead counsel for the Mexican American Legal Defense and Education Fund (MALDEF) in its 2001-2003 lawsuit against the Legislature’s 2001 congressional redistricting, but has endorsed “No on Proposition 20.”
October 18, 2010 at 10:10 pm
Eric Kirk
And if you look through the link I provided above, you’ll find that all of the progressive groups taking a position on the issue are voting no, while all the conservative groups are supporting it.
http://www.electioninfo.org/
That doesn’t make a no vote the right one. All of the progressive groups can be wrong. I’m just saying.
October 19, 2010 at 8:16 am
Not A Native
Well Eric so you’ve finally come out in favor of gerrymandering as a political tool. Your realpolitik (or more precisely facist) idea that the end justifies the means is about as far from liberal principles as one can go.
And gee Eric YOU’RE not impressed with Common Cause or I suppose the NAACP either. Well since you’re the arbiter of what is progressive and what isn’t, whatever YOU determine apriori is the sanctified word. But among the actual groups of your list, I find many ‘special interests’. And the Sac Bee as liberal? No way! I won’t even bother to respond to Mr. Nice’s screed that the folks in S.F. are all craven, it pure prejudice and idiocy.
Individuals can take positions but I’d say organizations have alot more legitimacy. That very issue has come up locally in Democrat endorcements and led to the expulsion of a DINO from the HDCC. I’d say the liberal groups in favor of prop 20 are acting more consistent with liberal ideas than the ‘gamers’ who observe the same policy as the CIA, you’ve got to do some bad things in the name of doing good. Well so much for Eric spin on ‘progressive’.
Sorry Eric, but that seems to be your MO a lot here. Counting prosperous noses, and when finding a fair number on one side making up some feeble rationale that they are ‘progressive’. And then trying to shame others into capitulating with that group under pain of being declared uneighborly or not ‘progressive’. Nothing more than a popularity poll with post facto justification. I’m sure it help maximize the pool of potential clients but it ain’t progressive.
October 19, 2010 at 10:50 am
Eric Kirk
So the League of Conservation Voters, the Sierra Cluib, Julian Bond, the nurses’ union, the teachers’ union – they aren’t progressive?
I’m not the one who started making determinations about progressive credentials. A few weeks ago you told me that I wasn’t progressive because I think that hanging yourself on hooks to wow and audience is a bad idea. Hence my point. I have a different idea of what it means to be progressive, and it has to do with supporting causes which empower groups out of the center of power such as ethnic minorities, working people, and environmentalists. This measure will put these groups at a further power disadvantage.
Do I support gerrymandering as a political tool? Quite frankly I don’t care about it one way or another so long as communities are not disempowered by it. What I don’t support is depriving one side of a tool while the other side retains it. That’s the practical effect of this measure. My point may not play well in Sunday School, but it is the reality of the existing power structure and if you prevail you will have succeeded in placing progressives at a further disadvantage in national politics and made further reforms in health care, opposition to wars, and economic reforms all but impossible to accomplish.
October 19, 2010 at 11:55 am
Not A Native
Some liberal organization are in favor of prop 20 and some are opposed. But Eric has DECREED that being against prop 20 is “progressive”. well it ain’t that simple. By supporting continuing gerrymandering you’re in favor of it no matter how you try to squeal that you aren’t. Gerrymandering exactly disempowers political minorities so your claim to support them as progressive is a lie, as the NAACP knows. There no two sides of the gerrymandering tool in California, prop 20 more fairly districts the State for all sides. You national level argument is specious. I’ve already debunked it. with no rebuttal.
Eric, you don’t walk the talk. You’ve got the rhetoric but not the stomach to actually follow up on embracing freedom of expression and challenging the status quo. You’re preferring ethnic minority communities to be split into different districts and have no political power, in favor of incumbents who garner support from the more privledged. As I’ve previously said, you’re a BOBO. and a squeamish one to boot, certainly not a progressive.
BTW, you opined that hanging on hooks was not just a “bad idea”, it was proof of mental illness that requres immediate treatment and rectification. After some backlash you retracted in fear of losing ‘popularity’. But again, you elide your statement to suit BOBO self denial.
October 19, 2010 at 1:06 pm
Eric Kirk
You haven’t debunked anything NAN, and you know very well that the net result will be fewer Democrats in Congress. That’s why the conservatives support it. If you don’t understand that, then you don’t have a clue as to what is happening here.
The NAACP endorsement is actually very controversial and being slammed by NAACP Chairman Emeritus Julian Bond (perhaps you are too young to know who he is – you might want to Google him) as the product of a political deal with the state NAACP chair. Unless you count AARP, there really are no other high profile progressives and it’s pretty much Chamber of Commerce groups you’ve thrown your lot with.
Again, to draw them up “more fairly for all sides,” whatever that means, will mean that Republicans draw the districts in the larger red states, while a panel which gives Republicans much more representation than they proportionally represent will draw the districts in two of the largest blue states.
Look, you’re entitled to your opinion. Just don’t pretend you’re doing it for the minorities, because those groups do not want to hand more power to Republicans. I will give you the benefit of the doubt and assume it’s not about deference to the Chamber and power, but instead you are operating by some higher ideal that if Democrats just make nice with the Republicans the Republicans will reciprocate. It’s a nice thought, and good for you for hoping for the best in people. Just try not to get in the way when the rest of us do what needs to be done.
October 19, 2010 at 2:05 pm
suzy blah blah
you opined that hanging on hooks was not just a “bad idea”, it was proof of mental illness that requres immediate treatment and rectification.
The ignorant opinion of a witch-hunter who tries to disguise himself as one who is caring and concerned for the health of the individual as well as the survival of the species. gmafb!
October 19, 2010 at 6:43 pm
Not A Native
Eric, now you’re telling me what I “know very well”? Your ego is so inflated you believe you can read minds.
As I referenced before, both liberal and conservative groups support prop 20, but I guess to you that means only the conservative groups know what they’re doing and those liberal groups are ignorant and being fooled or simply aren’t ‘really’ liberal (like Common Cause).
You’ve even dissed the NAACP as a group. Save your diety worship for a supernatural being, no human individual is beyond being mistaken or simply being in error. And that goes for Julian Bond as well as Steve Dazey, Bob McKee, and Mark Phelps(to put a local context on this). Your false logic would discredit ANY group decision that wasn’t unanimous by every senior member. Even the US Supreme Court doesn’t work that way, and shouldn’t.
Do you think its possible that the Republicans could be wrong and they won’t gain more seats among those new majority Black, Hispanic, Asian, and poor districts? No you don’t.
Basically you believe that if those now disempowered groups vote Democratic, it will result in Democrats being elected that you won’t like because they’ll promote the interests of their constiuencies that are now being diluted by gerrymandering. That gerrymandering is now divying up the electorate with the specific purpose of promoting the narrow interests of the privleged and better off, a group in which you are a member.
Fundamentally you don’t want those minority groups empowered because you believe they will upset your favored political arrangement(the status quo of untouchable political bosses preserving privleges for the most affluent, of both parties). So much for defending minorities that you have falsely claimed in the name of ‘progressivism’. But you’re a BOBO and what that really means is poseur.
Finally, your snobby attitude about “us” doing what “needs to be done” is the exact language that justified Native American massacres, Ruandan genocide, and countless other atrocities. But then intimidation and bulllying are your preferred tactics when your nature is unmasked.
October 19, 2010 at 7:21 pm
Eric Kirk
Okay NAN. You’ve named the California NAACP and Common Cause, which has sided with conservatives on a number of issues throughout the years. Anybody else?
Do you think its possible that the Republicans could be wrong and they won’t gain more seats among those new majority Black, Hispanic, Asian, and poor districts? No you don’t.
What new majority Black, Hispanic, and Asian districts are you talking about? How will there be more of them? Maybe you weren’t aware, but those groups tend to vote Democratic, so it’s already in the Democratic Party’s interest to create those districts. Splitting up the black vote benefits Republicans, not Democrats. The argument doesn’t even make sense.
It appears that the NAACP position is fueled by San Francisco, because some Hunter’s Point voters don’t want to be in the same bloc as the gay vote, and they would rather be attached to the San Mateo based districts. This won’t make them the majority, but they won’t be caught up in the socially liberal milieu of an SF based district, and they’ll probably get Oakland separated from Berkeley for the same reason. That’s probably the deal they struck with Republicans.
As for players knowing what they’re doing, I’m certain that the billionaire right winger Charles Munger who is financing the thing knows what he’s doing.
October 19, 2010 at 8:49 pm
Not A Native
Oh yeah, Charles Munger the Stanford physics PhD whose father is Warren Buffett’s partner. Merely being associated with the billionaire Buffett makes him worthy of tar and feathers, don’t ya think? And of course Buffett is a notroious right winger, NOT. There’s no factual basis to smear Munger as a bitter partisan, but that never deters a slanderer.
This post is waaay too long but rather than linking I just copied most of it.
Excerpts of an analysis of Munger and prop 27′s prime supporter:
Munger is convinced that if boundaries are drawn by a nonpartisan commission, the Legislature and Congress will become less partisan – though political scientists find little correlation between partisanship and how district lines are drawn.
Munger also may hope Republicans will gain seats in Congress and the state Legislature. He’d almost surely be wrong, given the GOP’s dwindling numbers in California. Democrats won’t lose control of the congressional delegation or Legislature anytime soon.
There are, however, individual Democrats who could be harmed if voters approve Munger’s new measure. And that’s where the other big spender comes in.
Haim Saban is a West Los Angeles billionaire entertainment mogul who made his initial fortune by producing “Mighty Morphin’ Power Rangers” and parlayed that into media holdings in Israel, Europe, Asia and the United States, where he has a major stake in the nation’s largest Spanish-language network, Univision.
In recent years, Saban veered somewhat Republican, giving $25,900 to Meg Whitman in January for her run for governor, $53,000 to Schwarzenegger, and the $200,000 to the Schwarzenegger- and Munger-backed 2008 reapportionment initiative.
In 1991, a three-judge panel drew lines intended to be nonpartisan. Democrats lost control of the Assembly for one term, but ended the 1990s with more seats in both houses than they had at the start of the decade.
In 2001, legislative leaders drew the lines and presented their plan to Gov. Gray Davis, who signed it. Democrats still dominate.
Garry South, then Davis’ chief political adviser, was so disgusted by the 2001 plan that he urged a veto. Republican and Democratic leaders colluded to ensure that politicians could choose their voters, rather than allowing voters to choose their politicians, he said.
“Both major parties want the right to gerrymander,” South said.
Reapportionment done by legislators is an ugly system. They protect their own, with little regard for parity or geography – certainly not for what’s fair to voters.
If Munger’s initiative were to succeed, Berman might face a primary challenge. OK. Why not work to win votes? Munger, meanwhile, might hope Republicans would pick up seats if his initiative were to become law.
Not likely. Only 30.8 percent of registered voters in California are Republicans. If lines had been drawn more fairly in 2001, South says, Democrats might have knocked out three or four Republicans this decade. In other words, sometimes donations can be a little like a trick cigar, the sort that blows up in a donor’s face.
http://www.sacbee.com/2010/04/18/2685019/donors-give-millions-hide-their.html
Since for you Eric, its all about nose counting and cosying up to whomever you feel is most popular and powerful, here the website list of prop 20 supporters and NYTimes comment about them.
The New York Times characterizes Proposition 20′s supporters as “an unlikely collection of election-reform groups, civil rights nonprofits and former officials from both major parties who say that the current system of redistricting has left politicians unaccountable.
Organizations
•AARP
•California Common Cause
•National Federation of Independent Business/California
•California State Conference of the NAACP
•American Nurses Association/California
•IndependentVoice.org
•Valley Industry and Commerce Association
•California Manufacturers & Technology Association
•Citizens for California Reform
•California Farm Bureau Federation
•Latin Business Association
•Western Electrical Contractors Association
•North Orange County Legislative Alliance
•San Gabriel Valley Economic Partnership
•Capitol Resource Institute
•Senior Advocates League
•Old Women’s League
•Progressive Democratic Club
•Democratic Women of San Bernardino County
•Bay Area Council
•Hispanic 100
•San Francisco Green Party
•California Metals Coalition
•California Restaurant Association
•Agricultural Action Committee
•Black Women Organized for Political Action
•San Diego Regional Economic Development Corporation
•Orange County Business Council
•North Bay Leadership Council
•Contra Costa Council
•Southwest Legislative Council
•American GI Forum
•Small Business Action Committee
•Americans for Prosperity, California
•Nisei Farmers League
•Federacion de Clubes Zacatecanos, Southern California
•Associated Filipino Organization of San Joaquin, Inc.
•Organization of Chinese Americans
•California Council of Churches IMPACT
•Laguna Woods Democratic Club
•Robert F. Kennedy Democratic Club, La Mirada
•Bonita Democratic Council
Steering Committee
•David Pacheco, California State President, AARP
•Aubry Stone, President, California Black Chamber of Commerce
•Allan Zaremberg, President/CEO, California Chamber of Commerce
•Kathay Feng, Executive Director, California Common Cause
•Julian Canete, Executive Director, California Hispanic Chambers of Commerce
•Alice Huffman, President, California State Conference of the NAACP
•Jon Coupal, President, Howard Jarvis Taxpayers Association
•Jason Olson, Director, IndependentVoice.org
•Ruben Guerra, President, Latin Business Association
•Gary Toebben, President/CEO, Los Angeles Area Chamber of Commerce
•John Kabateck, Executive Director, National Federation of Independent Business/California (NFIB/CA)
•Fred Keeley, Former Speaker pro Tempore, CA State Assembly; Treasurer, Santa Cruz County
•Betty Karnette, Former California State Senator
•Dede Alpert, Former California State Senator
•Delaine Eastin, Former California State Superintendent of Public Instruction
October 19, 2010 at 8:52 pm
Not A Native
Oops. missed copying this very telling portion:
Rep. Berman’s Los Angeles turf is heavily Democratic, but the population has changed since he was first elected in 1982; the number of Latinos has grown.
Berman long has worried that his district lines could be redrawn in a way that would leave him vulnerable to a primary challenge from a Latino Democrat. Why risk it? Berman would much prefer killing the Munger proposal, ensuring that his brother will draw his district lines next year.
October 19, 2010 at 9:09 pm
Anonymous
Oh yeah Munger’s a great guy!
http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/matt-taibbi/blogs/TaibbiData_May2010/207609/83512
October 19, 2010 at 9:20 pm
Eric Kirk
Well that’s certainly progressive. I wonder what he thinks about piercings.
October 19, 2010 at 10:31 pm
Not A Native
Guess Buffett supporting Obama and many humanitarian causes as well as endowing Gates’ charity fund is considered reactionary by BOBO standards. One thing’s for sure, Barack isn’t squeamish about piercings and doesn’t have a need to demonize those who have them to justify his prejudices.
October 19, 2010 at 10:36 pm
Eric Kirk
Oh, is Buffet supporting 20? I don’t see him on the list.
October 19, 2010 at 10:39 pm
Not A Native
BTW, its the elder Munger in the article, not the proponent of prop 20. But that doesn’t matter because its common sense and everybody knows that like father like son and whatever a parent says or does applies to their children too. Thats just the kind of progressive thought that Eric promotes here.
October 19, 2010 at 10:43 pm
Not A Native
Buffett isn’t in California ans has no stated position. But your smear was directed at Munger, based on his having billions of wealth that is actually Buffett’s, not his.
October 20, 2010 at 7:51 am
Eric Kirk
I don’t know what article you’re talking about, but if you have any doubt as to Munger’s politics, just google him. And you’re the one who brought up Buffet for some reason.
In any case, notwithstanding a few liberal exceptions, the bulk of progressives are rallying against this thing. After the NAACP and I’ll give you Common Cause for the sake of argument, you’ve got some local Democratic Clubs and the SF Green Party, which will support anything to shake up the status quo. But the bulk of the orgs in the list you posted are Chamber or business-oriented orgs. You didn’t notice that before you posted it?
October 20, 2010 at 7:53 am
Eric Kirk
Here’s an update on the Chamber controversy.
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2010/10/20/911721/-Chambers-true-agenda:-Corporate-profits-through-outsourcing
October 20, 2010 at 7:55 am
Eric Kirk
And more.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2010/10/20/911976/-Memo-LEAKED!-Beck,-Koch-bros,-Chamber-coordinated-with-BanksInsurers-on-2010-election-strategy
October 20, 2010 at 6:03 pm
Not A Native
Well lets count the number of members each organization has and find out which were polled on the position. You’re all about counting noses. Well on Nov 2, the noses will get counted on an equitable statewide basis, not district by district.
No this isn’t about Buffett but the fact that conservative groups as well as progressive groups support prop 20 lends some credibility to its being nonpartisan, objective, and a real reform. Only for those who are all about being a politically correct bitter partisan does it “look bad” to be seen consorting with the “enemy”. So it is for you, Eric.
Prop 20 is a good step to improve representation in government of whatever political persuasion. I think more democracy is a good thing even if the ‘wrong’ people sometimes win. Lincoln said “you can’t fool all the people all the time”, I value his wisdom. But he assumed all the people have an opportunity to be represented. Prop 20 helps make that a reality.
October 20, 2010 at 8:37 pm
Eric Kirk
Giving so much power to an unelected committee is hardly more democratic NAN.
October 20, 2010 at 8:50 pm
mresquan
Compared to the alternatives given in prop.20 and 27,is our current system of redistricting all that bad?
October 20, 2010 at 8:51 pm
mresquan
Errr…prior to 2008,I guess I was getting at.
October 20, 2010 at 9:01 pm
Eric Kirk
Hey, how did I “smear” Munger anyway? I said he is a right wing billionaire. He is in fact a right wing billionaire.
October 21, 2010 at 1:13 pm
Not A Native
Giving redistricting power to incumbents creates a clear conflict of interest and is less democratic then giving the power to people who don’t have a personal interest in the result. The present situation is similar to a judge deciding the validity the results of his/her election. The small difference is that results of a future rather than past election is being decided.
If you can’t understand conflict of interest Kirk, you’ve no right to be a lawyer or be on a board of directors. But I believe you DO understand conflict of interest, but are simply more than willing to accept it when it tilts in a manner you favor. As I wrote before, you repeatedly argue that the ends justify the means, the bedrock of facism.
October 21, 2010 at 8:26 pm
Eric Kirk
Actually, there is no conflict of interest where there are checks on power. The legislature votes on its own salary. If the voters don’t like the salary vote, they can vote the rep out. That’s democracy.
But if the voters don’t like this unaccountable committee’s decision, there is no recourse. Basically, the best we can hope for is a benevolent Junta.
October 22, 2010 at 2:21 pm
Not A Native
Sorry Eric, but with gerrymandering prewiring the election results, voters really can’t ‘vote them out’ despite their conflict of interest. Practically gerrymandering puts voters into a Hobsen’s choice of either tolerating corruption or voting for a political platform they don’t want. Thats whats caused the rise of ‘lesser of two evils” voting So your whole argument is false.
The committee is selected by elected official in a smilar manner to how Federal judges are selected. I’d say that pretty fair and predicts they can be as independent as the Federal judiciary. And they aren’t appointed for life like Federal Supreme Court judges.
FWIW all quasi-judicial regulatory commissions and agencies have appointed members who are nominally selected for some expertise in the area they regulate. While those agencies vary in effectiveness and competence, they certainly react to concerns of the elected officials. Theres no good reason to believe a redistricting commission would behave otherwise. And their deliberations would be public and comply with the Brown Act, a big big plus compared to legislative redistricting.
Would democracy be better served by electing every official with authority? I don’t think so. BTW, its felt by many(liberals and conservatives alike) that election of judges results in a less independent and objective judiciary. I’ve not studied the question, but the arguments and particular situations cited seem to have merit.
October 22, 2010 at 9:36 pm
Eric Kirk
Again, you misunderstand the whole concept of conflict of interest, but even that begs the question which you are avoiding. If this unelected commission acts in a way contrary to the will of the voters, what is the remedy?
October 23, 2010 at 5:22 pm
Not A Native
I didn’t misunderstand, Eric.
Right now there is no remedy, in actuality. You created a strawman ‘remedy’, voting the offenders out of office. Its a strawman because the current gerrymanding is explicitly designed and intended to ensure the ‘offenders’ have no chance to be voted out. But in your strawman world, you have it both ways, gerrymandering and a fair chance of removal. So whats the REAL remedy now??
So first of all, when enacted proposition 20 expresses the ‘will of the voters’ by specifiying criteria for redistricting, beyond simply population. One remedy is that voters could go to court if the commission doesn’t follow their ‘voter willed’ mandate. There will be a public record of their deliberations that shows the process they followed which can be reviewed by a judge. But the most important remedy is that for the first time redistricting is a PUBLIC process, not backroom dealing. The certainty that their work is open for inspection by all, especially the media and interest groups is the best protection voters have to ensure they follow the law in letter and intent.
Authorities that conduct their work in secret are never responsive to the needs of any but their favored special interests. That applies even more to boards of directors at private non-profits.
October 24, 2010 at 12:13 am
Eric Kirk
A judge can only overturn them if they do something illegal. But what is the remedy if they act legally, but against the will of the public? Whom do they answer to? What difference does it make if it’s public if the public has no recourse?
October 24, 2010 at 12:02 pm
Not A Native
When proposition 20 passes, it expresses the “will of the people’. Again Kirtk, you create a strawman to knock down. In fact, gerrymandering prevents the ‘will of the people’ from being obtained from the ballot box.
And your claim that judicial review isn’t a remedy is pure hogwash. What you’re really saying is that the will of the people isn’t expressed through enforcement of the laws that the people themselves enact. Totally preposterous. A small group of people operating in secret can never express the will of the people simply because the people aren’t party to the deliberations.
Really Kirk, I don’t think even you believde this silly argument, you’re just making rhetoric. Save it for a courtroom where even silly meritless arguments still put money in your pocket.
October 24, 2010 at 3:36 pm
Eric Kirk
If it passes it will represent the will of the people on November 2. The commission is then free to do what it wants, within the scope of the law (can’t discriminate, etc.), and if the people don’t like what comes out of the unelected committee, they’re screwed for generations to come.
Judicial review is generally very narrow in scope. Normally, political decisions are left to the political realm. This committee, will it be part of the legislative, judicial, or executive branches? Or will we be creating yet another branch?
Basically, you aren’t interested in democracy NAN. You want fewer Democrats in office, and you’re willing to sacrifice democracy to attain it. And your reasons for compromising democracy may be compelling, though I haven’t really read much from you on that point. But at least be honest about it.
October 24, 2010 at 4:17 pm
Not A Native
Basically Eric you’re too lazy to actually read the proposition and instead would rather throw out phony claims using politically loaded terms. thats your MO Kirk, assert you’re ‘progressive’ without factual basis but through inference by association with someone else. And throw it out for local consumption in hopes of creating a reuptation as an authority who is on the ‘right’ side of issues that no one else really understands.
But whenever confronted with any push back, as in the Kat situation, you bob and weave to avoid being revealed as self promoting poseur whose real agenda is to gain name recognition among potential future clients. But others here are on to you Kirk as merely a rather moderate Democrat who wants to enhance his status among more liberal neighbors.
As a direct example, you haven’t even looked at prop 20 to understand the particular judicial review REQUIRED in the law itself. But you readily criticize it because all you’re doing is parrotting some other BOBO. So here’s just a piece, that shows how shallow your ‘analysis’ is. BTW if I were to retain a lawyer, it sure wouldn’t be one whose opinions are based on no research but merely repeating something he else. Do you actually have the gall to charge people for that kind of non-work?
Eric you wrote ‘Judicial review is generally very narrow in scope. Normally, political decisions are left to the political realm.’ If you’d read the prop you’d know that idea doesn’t apply here at all:
(b) (1) The California Supreme Court has original and exclusive jurisdiction in all proceedings in which a certified final map is challenged or is claimed not to have taken timely effect.
(2) Any registered voter in this state may file a petition for a writ of mandate or writ of prohibition, within 45 days after the commission has certified a final map to the Secretary of State, to bar the Secretary of State from implementing the plan on the grounds that the filed plan violates this Constitution, the United States Constitution, or any federal or state statute. Any registered voter in this state may also file a petition for a writ of mandate or writ of prohibition to seek relief where a certified final map is subject to a referendum measure that is likely to qualify and stay the timely implementation of the map.
(3) The California Supreme Court shall give priority to ruling on a petition for a writ of mandate or a writ of prohibition filed pursuant to paragraph (2). If the court determines that a final certified map violates this Constitution, the United States Constitution, or any federal or state statute, the court shall fashion the relief that it deems appropriate, including, but not limited to, the relief set forth in subdivision (j) of Section 2.
Section 2 (j)
If the commission does not approve a final map by at least the requisite votes or if voters disapprove a certified final map in a referendum, the Secretary of State shall immediately petition the California Supreme Court for an order directing the appointment of special masters to adjust the boundary lines of that map in accordance with the redistricting criteria and requirements set forth in subdivisions (d), (e), and (f). Upon its approval of the masters’ map, the court shall certify the resulting map to the Secretary of State, which map shall constitute the certified final map for the subject type of district.
October 24, 2010 at 5:33 pm
Eric Kirk
A writ of mandate can be taken against any government body NAN. That’s not a remedy, unless there is a violation of law or an abuse of discretion. That is not what I am talking about. A writ is not the process of a democratic process.
The public does not have any remedy against the judiciary, except for a recall (which is not provided for with regard to the committee by prop 20). The judiciary is not democratic. Nor should it be. We have determined as a society that it is not productive to subject the judiciary to democracy. It is subject to judicial review, all the way to the top. That is not democracy.
The commission ill decide how the districts are shaped. By voting for proposition 20 you are determining that districts should not be drawn under the realm of democracy. It will not be conducted by elected representatives. If they do a bad job, there is no recourse unless it violates the law or abuses discretion.
October 28, 2010 at 9:37 am
Tired of the Politicians Yet? « REDHEADED BLACKBELT
[...] recommendations for local office. Also his picks for state and federal office as well as propositons. Excellent information on the local DA’s race can be found at the Times Standard’s [...]
December 13, 2010 at 12:38 pm
Marvin Shorter, Jr,
Divorce:
They say: God has a son, had God adopted a son, He would have adopted one from His own creation, but He is God.
The Holy Bible is a book of fantasies about the Messiah Jesus a man who was crucified by the pen. Who know more about a man murder then the men who committed the murder? Can you not see all the detail in the murder? To this day no man can give a full detail about a man life except “Lord God”. The Christians and the Jews over plotted in stealing information out of {The Koran with Parallel Arabic Text}.Can you not see that they are fantasizing about “Allah Almighty God” the World Greatest Most High Exalted Creator and Ruler of the Universe. Who did not take the form of a mortal man? This is but one of their fantasies, to clean you of your sins. All “Allah” need say is Be, & it is. People, (The Koran) is “Heaven”, and in Heaven you will find “God”, who lives in Heaven? Also you will find “Paradise” the home of the African-Americans who is the Israelites & Egyptians (Muslims) the faithful servants of Lord God. And the fire that surrounds “Paradise” is the Holy Bible of damnation. The tree that God had commanded you to keep away from He is the Forgiving One, the Merciful God. Allah, we submit this seeking Your divine mercy
December 13, 2010 at 12:41 pm
Marvin Shorter, Jr,
Infant:
“Allah” the one Lord God that is in all bibles promise the African-Americans who are the Israelites and Egyptians (Muslims) in making a sacrifice exalting Him over the Universe. He will exalt us over the United Nations. “Allah” please except this covenant: The Israelites Exalted Prophecy of Korah (Cf. Numbers xvi.)was one of Moses’ people. To “Allah” alone is true worship due. He alone is worthy of exalting to the highest highs of glory, honor and praise. Lord God, we submit this seeking Your mercy. Black people, can you not see that the white Christians and Jews are pretending to be us in the Holy Bible, the Hebrew Bible, the King James & others, the faithful servants of Lord God.
December 13, 2010 at 12:41 pm
Marvin Shorter, Jr,
People, who is it that protects all, and against Him there is no protect. Say: God. So will you not worship Him then?
Fear Allah Almighty God the World Greatest Most High Exalted Creator & Ruler of the Universe. Who will destroy all countries & nations that will not worship Him only showing Superior {Power & Strength} the All-powerful Lord God? Who has no son name Jesus or no wife name Mary. And it is a sin to say so. Will you not take heed? To Allah alone is true worship due. He alone is worthy of exalting to the highest highs of glory, honor and praise. It is “Allah” who warns you all before destruction (to repent) and fear His exalted (Power). Or be destroy by Him with: Fires and Smoke, Winds, Thunderstorms and Flooding, Mud, Snow and Hailstorms, Earthquakes, Tornados & Hurricanes and many others destructions by Lord God. Allah, let misery & misfortune falls on those that will not worship Him only.
February 14, 2012 at 4:33 pm
Not A Native
Eric wrote:
I don’t think you understand the proposition or the argument NAN. This isn’t term limits. It’s not about seniority. It’s about fewer Democrats in Congress and more Republicans. That will be the result – bottom line.
Well Eric, according to predictions, Democrats are expected to gain two to four seats in CA.
My response to you is that your habit of simply parroting other bloggers’ ideas doesn’t constitute thinking or analysis. It may be the best you’re capable to do, but its still piss poor.
February 14, 2012 at 5:15 pm
Eric Kirk
Actually it was my own idea, but I was wrong and you were right.
However, one reason I was wrong is that the Democrats outplayed the Republicans in the redistricting process. I’ll find the story I read on it. Kudos to them, but it doesn’t appear that politics have been effectively removed from the process.